Mouse Vs. Keyboard
you too?
interesting, baron.. now i'm really curious how many folks actually use that key. I'm a faithful keyboarder and would never use slow mode to get better aim. it'd.. take too long. then again, my aim isn't too horrible either.. (nor is yours, which futher confuses me that you'd use the key) It takes a while to hone, but you can get that twitch timing down so that you don't have to "correct" for it -- so you get it right the first time. Maybe a good poll in order..
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On servers that require jumping onto narrow platforms, the slow key is a must (so you don't overshoot your target). I usually can't "climb" a series of steps without it. I might just not be very coordinated thoughlearner wrote:Hopefully not diverging too far off the topic, I'm perplexed by this statement. I've not heard of anyone useing the slow keyboard motion key for actual "normal" game play *ever* before this (it was "mostly" added for developmental testing and never removed).Constitution wrote:I beg to disagree. I use the "Slow Keyboard Motion" key quite regularly in very "normal" circumstances. And for the rest of the time, why would anyone want to go slower than full speed? Very rarely.
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In fact, I'm highly considering removing the key binding for the next major release or if anything, binding it to a key other than 'a' by default given all the problems it causes. Players frequently accidentally hit the 'a' key without noticing (usually while trying to hit tab or 'z' or something "over there") and end up baffled how to get out of the molasses mode. They usually end up restarting the client, unfortunately, since it also acts/looks/feels like the game just suddenly slows down on you like it could be a bug.
Perhaps "normal" wasn't the right word... I was trying to make a counterpoint to someone's statement that you can't move at lower-than-highest speed on a keyboard under "normal" conditions. The vast majority of the time I drive at regular speed, of course. However, I do use the slow keyboard motion key under "normal" conditions in several scenarios. Most of the time I just want to jump onto a box that's right in front of me, so I do a slow-motion jump rather than backing up all the way for a full-speed jump.learner wrote:Hopefully not diverging too far off the topic, I'm perplexed by this statement. I've not heard of anyone useing the slow keyboard motion key for actual "normal" game play *ever* before this (it was "mostly" added for developmental testing and never removed).Constitution wrote:I beg to disagree. I use the "Slow Keyboard Motion" key quite regularly in very "normal" circumstances. And for the rest of the time, why would anyone want to go slower than full speed? Very rarely.
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In fact, I'm highly considering removing the key binding for the next major release or if anything, binding it to a key other than 'a' by default given all the problems it causes. Players frequently accidentally hit the 'a' key without noticing (usually while trying to hit tab or 'z' or something "over there") and end up baffled how to get out of the molasses mode. They usually end up restarting the client, unfortunately, since it also acts/looks/feels like the game just suddenly slows down on you like it could be a bug.
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Re: you too?
Wait learner, I do not use keyboard. I think you are confusing me. Yes I have played with keyboard, that was to understand how the keyboard reacts, and how my opponents using keyboard play. The simplicity of the keyboard has a few advantages in ducati. A big plus, is doing the merry-go-round with your opponent. its simple, yet also very restrictive. Simply hold down the left (or right key) + the forward (or reverse key). and then, to keep the turn righter, one must simply varient the reverse + forward key. You get the picture.learner wrote:interesting, baron.. now i'm really curious how many folks actually use that key. I'm a faithful keyboarder and would never use slow mode to get better aim. it'd.. take too long. then again, my aim isn't too horrible either.. (nor is yours, which futher confuses me that you'd use the key) It takes a while to hone, but you can get that twitch timing down so that you don't have to "correct" for it -- so you get it right the first time. Maybe a good poll in order..
This is what I use - and have used, since the first generation trackballs -
Learner - a more accurate depiction of my aiming process, from a previous post, would be, play on a pillbox map, with a keyboard, and try to line up a shot, into the opposing teams base. Try it from all angles. Some angles you have a wider window of opportunity, some you do not. Its much harder to shoot into the base, with a keyboard, then a mouse. not impossible. but the time it takes to aim or manuever is longer than what it would take a mouse user.
is the slow motion used, say, in ducati? I would say never. IIRC the only time slow motion was introduced, was with jumping, when map makers started making complex jumping maps, and annoyingly small jump platforms. keyboarders couldn't make the jumps. Back then, they had nothing to control their speed with, it was WOT or nothing. There was debate of, adding a small visible amount of acceleration to the keyboard, so they could time, and perform the jumps, but that was struck down, and instead, we have A - half speed. I do not use the key. I HAVE used the key, but that was when I was testing out keyboard.
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Re: you too?
I've always wondered about that setup... how do you use the trackball? It is for driving the tank? That would mean you arent moving your wrist at all. Or is it for shooting like most other players have mapped shooting to the mousewheel? But then the trackball wouldnt be much different to a normal mouse.The Red Baron wrote:
Shed some light into that please.
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my mousewheel controls my radar. not shooting. It groups the shots way to closely. And, No moving of my wrist at all. Just the thumb. I use the mouse button for shooting, along with qwe. (BTW - some consider this info i'm giving confidential)
Yes, I drive the tank with the trackball. Again, I don't have shooting mapped to the mousewheel - i don't like it.
Yes, I drive the tank with the trackball. Again, I don't have shooting mapped to the mousewheel - i don't like it.
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Ok, a few things:
1. Yes, I should think a lot of keyboard players do use 'a', not just for testing/debugging/whatever it was originally intended for. Please keep the function in, though you can map it to any key you like, I'll just change it anyway.
2. TheRedBaron: No offence, but you're talking about something you don't truly understand. You say you "tried keyboard". Is that for a period of 6 months or more? I can aim perfectly fine with my keys, I don't have to twitch back and forth, not even when aiming into a pillbox base - though I have occasionally used my binos if I am near the centre of the map, heading towards the enemy base right after they were capped - it is safe to do so, after-all, and from that sort of angle, most of the gaps are just one or two pixels thick - I doubt a mouse player can instantly aim directly at anything that small without slight readjustments.
3. As for the "Good Timing" on jumps...
1. Yes, I should think a lot of keyboard players do use 'a', not just for testing/debugging/whatever it was originally intended for. Please keep the function in, though you can map it to any key you like, I'll just change it anyway.
2. TheRedBaron: No offence, but you're talking about something you don't truly understand. You say you "tried keyboard". Is that for a period of 6 months or more? I can aim perfectly fine with my keys, I don't have to twitch back and forth, not even when aiming into a pillbox base - though I have occasionally used my binos if I am near the centre of the map, heading towards the enemy base right after they were capped - it is safe to do so, after-all, and from that sort of angle, most of the gaps are just one or two pixels thick - I doubt a mouse player can instantly aim directly at anything that small without slight readjustments.
3. As for the "Good Timing" on jumps...
No time at all, I am talking about hitting the forward/backward key + the left/right key + the jump key all at almost exactly the same time. It is almost instantaneous, the "timing" here is a matter of nanoseconds. I doubt that is any slower than the amount of time it would take a mouse player to accelerate and jump.The Red Baron wrote: You can time it perfectly, but how long will it take you?
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CBG - No offense taken - you know I don't mind being disagreed with.
have I played for a period of 6 months on keyboard? no. And hate to tote this - but I can somewhat seamlessly adjust and play decently, because I understand the mechanics of the game.
Now, I do not have facts, graphs, tables, numbers, etc etc etc. Except personal experience and an unshaken reality that most of your mouse players are quite better than keyboard players.
why is that?
and ya, I still disagree with you on the timing - it takes longer
have I played for a period of 6 months on keyboard? no. And hate to tote this - but I can somewhat seamlessly adjust and play decently, because I understand the mechanics of the game.
Now, I do not have facts, graphs, tables, numbers, etc etc etc. Except personal experience and an unshaken reality that most of your mouse players are quite better than keyboard players.
why is that?
and ya, I still disagree with you on the timing - it takes longer
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/me is a devoted keyboard player.
For a while I had an inferiority complex thinking that only the mouse was for serious players, and I usually work with it a little when I'm in Ducati-like servers.
However, there are servers in which I think keyboard play is indispensable... those that require binoculars often, a reliance on the radar, long range sniping, and/or a lot of straight forward motion. This is why I'm lousy in servers like Ducati, but have halfway decent scores in places like The Two Tanks, Loumans LaserMania, and definitely Inferno's Sniper Haven.
I would gladly take on any mouse player in Sniper Haven. Name the time and place :)
Here is my key mapping:
jump: space
fire: z
binoculars: x
drop flag: a
slow movement: q
lock/identify: tab
For a while I had an inferiority complex thinking that only the mouse was for serious players, and I usually work with it a little when I'm in Ducati-like servers.
However, there are servers in which I think keyboard play is indispensable... those that require binoculars often, a reliance on the radar, long range sniping, and/or a lot of straight forward motion. This is why I'm lousy in servers like Ducati, but have halfway decent scores in places like The Two Tanks, Loumans LaserMania, and definitely Inferno's Sniper Haven.
I would gladly take on any mouse player in Sniper Haven. Name the time and place :)
Here is my key mapping:
jump: space
fire: z
binoculars: x
drop flag: a
slow movement: q
lock/identify: tab
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When I first posted here I misunderstood what using the mouse meant. What I do is I use both the mouse and the keyboard:
Right Hand:
Fire: Left Mouse Button
Jump: Middle Mouse Button
Identify/Spawn: Right Mouse Button
Left Hand:
Jump: Tab
Toggle Scores: S
Drop Flag: Space
Binoculars: B (Yes I know it's a bit of a reach, but it is feasible).
Right Hand:
Fire: Left Mouse Button
Jump: Middle Mouse Button
Identify/Spawn: Right Mouse Button
Left Hand:
Jump: Tab
Toggle Scores: S
Drop Flag: Space
Binoculars: B (Yes I know it's a bit of a reach, but it is feasible).
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Maybe I'm misunderstanding too, but I think we are talking about what you drive with?A Distraction wrote:When I first posted here I misunderstood what using the mouse meant. What I do is I use both the mouse and the keyboard:
Right Hand:
Fire: Left Mouse Button
Jump: Middle Mouse Button
Identify/Spawn: Right Mouse Button
Left Hand:
Jump: Tab
Toggle Scores: S
Drop Flag: Space
Binoculars: B (Yes I know it's a bit of a reach, but it is feasible).
Like I said, joystick all the way for me.
Forward/backward on Y-axis, turning on Z-rotation. Works great, and it's fast. You have complete control, like a mouse. Plus my coordination is much better with joystick than with a mouse.
But I'm better with keyboard than with mouse anyways. It's great for quick direction changes. Mouse AND joystick make you less agile.
The reason I use a joystick is mostly because it's the most fun to play with.
And that's what a game is for, right? Having fun.
Forward/backward on Y-axis, turning on Z-rotation. Works great, and it's fast. You have complete control, like a mouse. Plus my coordination is much better with joystick than with a mouse.
But I'm better with keyboard than with mouse anyways. It's great for quick direction changes. Mouse AND joystick make you less agile.
The reason I use a joystick is mostly because it's the most fun to play with.
And that's what a game is for, right? Having fun.
Maybe I was unclear.When I first posted here I misunderstood what using the mouse meant. What I do is I use both the mouse and the keyboard:
I use the keyboard for driving and everything. I guess you can access the binoculars as easily either way. However, using the keyboard allows you to play from the radar more easily without having to look back and forth between the mouse box and radar, (I make the radar full size with no opacity in Hepcat) it allows you to go quickly from full speed one way to full speed the other, and you can go straight forward or stand still easily without having to put your mouse in the dead-zone. I have everything right there where I want it so I can use B, chat, taunt, slow motion, hunt, switch off the console etc.. without having to drop or grab my mouse while I'm geno'ing you. :p
or maybe my preference is just due to years of gaming before I had a mouse.
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I play with my trackpad fairly often, not all that difficult at all.
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